Categories Religion Is Heaven and Hell Real? Post author By Caretaker Post date October 3, 2012 17 Comments on Is Heaven and Hell Real? Is Heaven and Hell real? If they are then we need proof. Asked by Paul M Tags Heaven, Hell ← My Journey Into Spirit Rescue → Why is Spirituality Important? 17 replies on “Is Heaven and Hell Real?” Hello Paul, Define what proof you need and why? I have been to heaven and remember the experiences, I have been to a place you might consider hell, but it wasn’t. My experiences are subjective. No one has ever brought back tangible proof that either place exists, only their own visions or memories. Hell is a home for demons. Heaven is the Home of humanity, when we are not living on this earth, and even when we are. Love & Peace Ama Nazra Hi Paul M The whole point of having Faith, is the total and absolute belief in the existance of something despite a total lack of proof to back up the claim. People have killed and died in the name of a variety of religions. All of it based on the belief that something exists without a shred of edivence to prove that their god/gods actually do exist. May I ask why you demand proof of the existance of heaven and hell? Are you at a spiritual crossroads? In my view heaven, hell and whatever names other religions link the general concept to those names, are personal to each and every one of us. In other words, if someone does not believe in hell then it does not exist to them. As it does not exist to them, they will never find themselves there. But someone who believes in hell may well judge themselves so harshly upon death that they end up going there – just because that is where they believe they deserve to be due to their ‘wickedness’. Like Ama, I’ve been to both – and other places besides. Neither heaven nor hell are physical places, unlike the earth. They are ‘concepts’ or ‘state of mind’ or ‘dream state’ – whichever makes it easier for you to understand. But, that does not mean they are imaginary, because they are not. They are just not the same concept as, say, the earth. AJ x Good morning AJ, How do we explain those people who die and end up in ‘hell’, even though they say they never believed in it? It’s not really a trick question. LOL Is it that, being human we are the creators of our reality, and somewhere, in the back of those people’s minds, is a belief in divine punishment? Or is it that they have chosen not only to die and return, but also to bring back ‘memories’ of experiences to encourage either good behaviour, or just plain fear, in others? To Paul: I’m a spirit rescuer (ghostbuster) and have often rescued ghosts from within a bubble of energy that they have created around themselves that could be described as hellish .. but it is their creation, not forced on them by someone else. The Buddha reminds us “with our thoughts we create the world” … Very interesting topic, thank Paul. Love & Peace Ama Hi Ama They must’ve believed in a hell-like state, or why send themselves to a place of punishment that resembles a dipiction of it? So, I’ll go with your “… being human we are the creators of our reality, and somewhere, in the back of those people’s minds, is a belief in divine punishment.” Actually, same thing happens with Heaven. Your heavenly experience and dipiction of it is much different to mine. Yet, it is the same ‘place’. We know that because the energy gives it away. LOL! I liked your ‘bubble’ comment to Paul. That was a very good explanation. AJ x Hello Paul, Are you real? I could still choose to deny it, despite proof in photography, as I haven’t ever met you. 🙂 Honestly, I understand your question….I just really don’t know how to answer. How can you prove that reality is real, let alone a place we hope to go/hope we never go (respectively)when we are done with this unexplainable “real”? I’ve tried to deduce this before, then the following night had a dream where someone ran up to me and said: “Hey?! Well is this real?” To which I replied: “Well, yes it is!!…..I think…..no, this is a dream……ahhh, I’m lucid dreaming again!!! Wait, then what is ‘real’?!”. Then again, I’ve found lately that I’m a bit of a minority with respect to dreams….I feel/smell/see/hear better in dreams then I do in “reality” (by an insane amount). I can’t help you with proof,though. Not too many can. But if reality as a whole is as relative as time itself, then our discussion would have no end. To that degree, I completely agree with A.J….if it’s real to you, isn’t that what matters? Quantum activists like Amit Goswami believe we create absolutely every bit of reality together, somewhere before consciousness…hence the concept of multiple realities co-existing. David Bohm used physics equations to prove that “reality” is quite possibly an illusion, as it works with similar principles as holograms. But I mentioned dreams because they are the closest examples I can use to a “mental world”. Problem for me, as mentioned above, my “mental world” is more real and physical then my waking reality, a majority of the time. Does that mean it is physically tangible, and this existence is impalpable? Could it be both? And because I’m a fan of analogies….. I know exactly 7 people who say they have seen a UFO. I have not. Because I have not, do UFO’s exist? Discovery channel hasn’t helped this at all. I will probably believe they exist when I see one for myself. But is that proof they exist? To me, it would be…..but, not according to the scientific method or peer review. so, Somebody else needs to see/document your UFO or agree with you based on your credentials….then you can go film a documentary. 20 million people watch…..do they believe in UFOs? If so, does that make UFOs real? Simply pointing out that these are two different questions. So, I’m curious: What is your idea of Heaven and Hell? What do you think they are? If either was a mental word (non-physical all together), then would “proof” still have to come in a physical form? IMHO, Logic would dictate that our postulate about this is malformed by either faith in it, or skepticism against, making “proof” a surprisingly irrelevant factor. Thanks….great question. -Siddle Hi Siddle When you talk of dreams it always reminds me of The Matrix (in the most sincerely way – I’m not taking the rise out of you!) I have (as Ama would say) events, not dreams. Had some pretty weird one’s lately. One about covert UFO’s and the Dragon springs to mind … that was wierd … particularly as my camera jammed so I couldn’t take photo’s of any of it in my dream! (I often dream I have a camera but I never seem to get a picture of the event …. the camera always jams up, or I click too late! Now that’s gotta mean something – lol!) It is interesting how you say your senses are hightened during your lucid dreams. I’m aware of that when I dream too – except for pain. I never feel any pain! AJ x AJ .. when you get photos I want copies .. or can I borrow your camera? 😉 Love & Peace Ama LOL! No point borrowing my camera … it doesn’t seem to work when it should! AJ x A.J. If you were taking the rise out of me, I’d not take it personally. I would appreciate the rip and laugh. I mean, I’ve never done the “slow motion bullet-time dodging of projectiles meant to impale me”-thing, but I’ve also never lead zombies around all night (yes, I also remember other people’s dreams!). 😛 I wish I could say the same about pain. At age 10, I recall going into the doctor to get a shot of penicillin (some crazy infection was going ’round at school), and my doctor told me “you’ll just feel a little ‘pressure’ like a pen prick”….to which I replied, “or like a shot….because it’s a shot” (I have been and will always be a smart a__.) I didn’t say it to the doctor, but I remember being pretty scared because I had received shots (mostly by force) in some wicked dreams. When he was done, I thought to myself: “this is nothing!” So, while my parents may have thought I had a really high pain threshold….it was more likely the fact that in dreams “pain” has a completely different ceiling…for me, a much higher one. To that degree, I really wish I could agree with you, A.J. But pain is also much much worse in dreams for me…..more “real”. More impactful. Longer lasting….more visceral. Over the years, I have learned to control that a bit…but still struggle with it if I’m not fully lucid. On a considerably brighter note, as I’m getting older, I have more food allergies in waking reality. Completely allergic to onions, in point of fact. I had a plate of spaghetti in one of my dreams last night. The noodles were made of onions. It was fantastic….and I didn’t need an EpiPen or a stay in the hospital! So Matrix-y…yes, A.J. But more Cypher eating a steak, then Neo dodging mortar shells, kind of matrix-y. 🙂 -Siddle Hi Siddle So sorry you get the pain thing. I think Ama suffers the same? I’m so grateful I don’t …. well, not yet anyway (looks nervously over left shoulder …) (Not) feeling your pain – lol! AJ x Hey guys, Pain in dreams? Not that I remember, but then I don’t remember dreams much anyway. I admire both you, AJ, and Siddle, for your ability to even remember your dreams. What I do share is the onion allergy .. not to the point of needing hospital, but if I eat too much my eyes swell shut. Try explaining that to one particular family member who demands them in everything I cook? LOL But I am synching on your post Siddle, because I had a ‘dream’ .. what do you call a dream when you are 3/4 awake and just blink out for a moment? .. where I was walking down the front garden path here (just outside the window .. I was looking at the spot when it happened, from the couch) .. and a hand came up out of the soil and tried to grab my ankle. I quickly pulled away, sort of woke up, and then mentally turned back, grabbed the hand and tried to pull the person out of the ground .. the way I had in another dream I do remember, which was set in Highgate Cemetary in London. In that one a group of us was going around yanking people out of the ground, by their hands which were poking out of the ground (and this was before “What dreams may comes (movie)) and saying something like “Second coming, you are redeemed, you can go to heaven now”. I woke up from that one with a very sore shoulder. Hmm…. Is there someone buried under my house? I have also dreamed there’s a big vortex under this town I now live in? Interesting .. Love & Peace Ama Thanks A.J. It’s called compartmentalization….I wouldn’t be alive without it! (big playful smiley) Seriously….I appreciate it, but–and I know I’ll sound a little crazy for this one–I don’t mind the pain…it was a catalyst to follow-up questions about the difference between reality and dreams. Pain was a teacher in this case. I can’t regret that growth. Besides, I’m pretty desensitized now……I don’t want you all to think I wake up every morning screaming. That’s only during the work week! ha! Ama, 3/4 awake sounds a lot like the hypnagogic state. I spend quite a bit of time here lately. I’m starting to believe it’s a similar realm as FA and SP. Difference is, I can usually still move. It is in this state that I have access to dreamworld and reality at the same time. At first it was a bit confusing, but then I found I could work through a lot of information there. One morning, as I was processing the translation of several dreams, I thought of a problem at work, and then found the solution by trial and error (still in this state). By the time I was fully awake, I was coding like a maniac. I like this place because it seems to be a circumvention of conscious filters. Where you are able to process a lot more emotions and thoughtforms then in waking reality OR dreams. Almost every book idea (that I’ll never finish) started here, too. And I’m sorry you are also afflicted by the almighty onion. What about garlic? I can still eat garlic (odd because same family as onions)….but onions cause a lot of damage to me, these days. Weird part is, I used to be able to eat them whole, on the farm, when I was a child. I didn’t gain this allergy until I was about 24 (took 2 hospital visits and about 6 weeks of keeping a food journal before I knew what was causing the problem). Even weirder…I’m hearing of more and more people that are allergic or intolerant to onions these days. So the real question is….what are the onions planning? What are they up to? Are they plotting the demise of humanity? Step #1: White Castle in every town. Step #2: White Castle on every block of every town. Step:#3 Usurp the human interlopers using hives and gastrointestinal warfare!!!!!! -Siddle Hi Siddle I’ve been worrying about going off on tangents on the question site, but that is a doozy, Siddle. Since we are already here, I’ll tell you I can eat garlic too. A scientific friend explained to me that onions and garlic have different chemical makeups (although they are from the same family, as you said) so yes, I can eat a normal amount of garlic (garlic and cheese pizza, yum!) but not too much (Penshurst is a very windy place already, it doesn’t need help LOL). I hadn’t thought of the hypnogogic state, but I can induce it in myself, and I think its where I usually have my visions. I wonder if its the state that people call ‘trance’ when they are going to channel entities? I am very happy to hear you don’t wake up screaming. 🙂 And pain really is a great tool for learning, mostly in hindsight, having done that myself. It can even be completely life changing (or slowing down .. creaking bones here, having spent most of yesterday doing some serious gardeing). LOL Wishing you a good day, Love & Peace Ama I tend to believe what one religion believes altho Im not a follower of that religion. They believe there is is no heaven and hell, that the good people will live forever on a new reformed earth that God has turned into a paradise, and the bad people will just be destroyed. That seems to make the most sense to me. Every religion says every other religion is going to hell or destruction, so if thats the case no one will end up in paradise. Is there a hell ? Jesus preaced more about hell than any one in the bible. He described it as a place of weeping n knashing of the teeth- maggot never dies- eternal fire- Jesus paid for our sins on the cross – or you must pay for your sins after you die! Lies lust hatred pride envy idolatry fornication malice deceit thieving greed etc etc etc Hello Scott, Is there a hell? Well, there are demons, and they have a home, just like we do .. so yes, there’s a home for demons .. but the Christian bible teaches it as a punishment place for them, (and us) – which means they don’t ‘live’ there, so where do they live? Is that why they keep attacking humans, or hanging about us .. because they have no home? Separation from God would be ‘hell’ to me, but he provided them with a place, because God provides for all its creations, and forgives all .. or that is what Jesus taught. So who do we believe? How much of your knowledge of ‘hell’ do you base from Revelation, where most of the information seems to come from that people cling to with such glee? Jesus didn’t write Revelation. He also didn’t write the gospels. Yes, he is said to be the avenging spirit of God in that book, but truthfully, how do you reconcile the Jesus who taught ‘love and peace’ with the fiery character that the author of Revelation created .. probably 70-95 years after Jesus was born. I am not feeling well this morning, having caught a virus that is floating around town, so let’s take a shortcut. I like this article. It seems to have a balanced explanation. godsbreath.net/2011/12/23/how-could-hell-be-just/ I don’t think ‘hell’ is just, I think its a home for demons. We humans create our own hell, within our own minds, and take it with us when we die. I know this because I have ‘rescued’ people from imagery like that, a bubble they wrap around themselves when they are dead. And my theologist training explains Revelation as a commentary on what God would do to Nero and other persecutors of Christians at the time of it’s writing. Still hasn’t happened. But I do wonder what Nero thought when he died and crossed into heaven. Karma can be .. ‘just’ .. we might define it as cruel. Of the 46 comments Jesus is said to have made about hell, the place he mentioned was Gehenna .. which was a dump in a valley outside the city of Jerusalem. It was only later ‘theologians’ that defined it in other ways, and made it a place that humans were sent to, not just the fallen angels that Revelation spoke of in the beginning. Love & Peace Ama Hello Scott, Welcome to PQA! Nice t have you! 😀 You said, “Jesus paid for our sins on the cross or you must pay for those sins if you die.” That, in and of itself is a confusing statement. Does it mean that Christ paid for the sins of our past or does it mean ALL sins? If it means ALL sins then why are we going to have to pay for them when we die? Scott, I am not mocking you in any way, I am just challenging your beliefs, as many of us here do to each other, as well as those who come on here for the first time. I do this to further understand why people believe as they do, and it also helps me better understand why I believe as I do. You see, Scott, I am not someone who can take things at “face value” or believe something because “I am told to” or “because the Bible tells me so.” In fact, my next question would be, “Who wrote the Bible?” There are, after all 13 different versions, and each version has been altered in some way, by being translated, edited with parts added or removed. So then, “How are we supposed to know exactly what to believe or even which version of the Bible is even the right one? And if God were, in fact, the author, and He wanted us to know something, wouldn’t He have told everyone in the world and not just say, “the Jews?” Some call it the unerring “word of God” but is it, really? How do you know with 100% certainty? Especially with so many hands passing on it and altering it? How do you even know if the original authors were even channeling the Spirit of God? Do you know with complete certainty? Were any of us around at the time of the “penning?” And since I have to stay on topic and not go as far off tangent as I have – what of Heaven and Hell? None of us can prove that with 100% accuracy, as fact, leaving no room for doubt. In the end it is what we all believe that matters and why we believe it. So now I will answer the OP with, it is my belief that Hell is a place for demons and not humans. I believe in an all Loving God who created and loves us ALL. I also believe that, when we do wrong, it is “WE” who punish ourselves, not God. I do not want to sound like a “parrot” to Ama, because I share many of her beliefs and not because she told me to, but because I feel, in my heart that it is right. A Spiritual journey is a personal journey one must take alone; no one should ever tell you what to believe. Question everything, and draw your own conclusions. Your relationship with God is yours and yours alone.